back to article Microsoft's nightmare DEEPENS: Windows 8 market share falling fast

Just when you thought it couldn't get much worse for Microsoft, analysis by Netmarketshare and StatCounter has found Windows 8's market share fell during September 2014. As we point out each month when reporting the firms' data, their methodology of analysing web traffic is far from perfect. On the other hand, the two firms …

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  1. Youngdog

    *

    *please note that, due to the unique way Netmarketshare and StatCounter provide analysis, the value of your contribution may not reflect the bollock-sweating effort guys like you put in moving tens of thousands off XP and will instead appear as a just a piddling few hundred IP addresses.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: *

      Right in one. As a survey of consumer device operating systems (lots of IP addresses) it works. I'd even agree with SO/HO & SMB. Otherwise? Meh. And I don't want to think about what my site looks like to the survey dataset.

      1. John Bailey

        Re: *

        So the next time someone is wittering on about Linux only having 1%, I can rely on you guys to set em straight?

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: *

      Regardless of which version of Windows is actually being used - it still has over 90% desktop market share - and revenue is steady - so not exactly a nightmare for Microsoft.

      Windows 10 will come along, address the issues some people don't like about Windows 8, and most people will eventually migrate. Yawn.

    3. Bob Vistakin
      Facepalm

      Re: *

      Looks like this asshole was spot on to me.

      1. Breen Whitman

        Re: *

        Balmer is spot on about nothing. The recovery from vista was entering into the new apple/android handheld era.

        Even if there was no vista and it went straight to a win 7, they would lose out. They failed to succeed in the mobile market early enough.

        Win CE 5/6 on $3000 dollar industrial handhelds even in 2014, and expecting that to be a "mobile business case", was delusional.

    4. JeffyPoooh
      Pint

      A suggestion for MS

      As far as I can tell, they refuse to sell Windows 7 (e.g. Professional) FPP ('full retail') at all.

      I bought a used gaming PC for a good price, and it did not include a Windows CoA. So I went looking for an OS for it, specifically Windows 7 Professional. I wanted the FPP version so that if my used PC burned up, at least the license could be moved around legally.

      As far as I could tell, Microsoft's policy was religion-based that "Yee Shall Convert To Windows 8 and Yee Shall Not Be Sold Windows 7."

      I understand that there are some non-intuitive solutions, but they seem to cost about $300.

      The suggestion is: Why don't they turn on the Windows 7 FPP factory again? I've got a crisp stack of cash if they'd be willing to put down the Windows 8 Bible for a minute, and take my money.

      Their Windows 8 policies are equivalent to insane and/or stupid. Now that they've seemingly gotten over the cult-like approach and essentially admitted that Win 8 is a failure, then the next logical interim step is to release a flood of Win 7 Pro FPP for about $100 per copy. I'd guess that they could stir up a few hundred million dollars in sales.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: A suggestion for MS

        "next logical interim step is to release a flood of Win 7 Pro FPP for about $100 per copy. I'd guess that they could stir up a few hundred million dollars in sales."

        That might get them some sales right now, but it would shoot Windows 10 straight in the head. They're depending on the current Windows 8 lot, who're desperate to get away from the bloody thing, to give 10 its big initial boost. They're absolutely desperate to avoid Windows 7 becoming the next XP, and hanging around for the next decade eating their new OS's for lunch, and they certainly don't want any new users for it now.

        1. JeffyPoooh
          Pint

          Re: A suggestion for MS

          "...shoot Windows 10 straight in the head."

          Not if this happens:

          1) Windows 10 is actually attractive, with the stupidity surgically removed.

          2) Windows 10 works well with the hardware from the Win 7 era (2010 +/-).

          3) They offer a reasonably price upgrade (correct answer is $60).

          As of right now, our nice 2nd hand gaming PC is running Ubuntu. So how is their clever (not) marketing scheme working out for them so far?

          1. Naughtyhorse

            Re: with the stupidity surgically removed.

            you mean like;

            c:>_

          2. Phil_Evans

            Re: A suggestion for MS

            I suggest you may have missed a point:

            4) They manage to wrestle folks away from Windows 7

            As of now, MSFT's active code base is supported (in various cocktails) from XP, through vista, Win7, Win8 and soon Win10. Not mention the server derivatives too.

            People have obviously decided that even if looks are different, Win8 smells like a leap to a new vista. they have defined their buying behaviours on mobile by ignoring Surface and Phone. Why produce more answers when people have stopped asking the questions?

            Pah.

        2. Brian Souder 1

          Re: A suggestion for MS

          "They're depending on the current Windows 8 lot, who're desperate to get away from the bloody thing, to give 10 its big initial boost. They're absolutely desperate to avoid Windows 7 becoming the next XP, and hanging around for the next decade eating their new OS's for lunch, and they certainly don't want any new users for it now."

          This is already the stage they set. All of the Windows XP and 2003 server users I finally pried away to Server 2012 and 2012 R2 as well as Windows 7 have no intention of upgrading. Most of the upgrades were fairly painless, but expensive. They end up replacing all their hardware or updating machines that had originally been downgraded from Windows 7/Vista to XP - still tech hours. The economy still is not great - recovering from upgrades takes years. They just got their users over to Windows 7 - etc. I still have one company holding on to their 2003 server and XP for dear life even though most of the apps are up to date (Office 2013 being the exception that will be updated with a purchase). There are odd things going on like WIndows 7 profiles going bad, issues with Office 2013 and IMAP which we are finding solutions to finally. They are so focused on moving forward they have not stopped to get everyone's confidence. I sent out the Windows 10 email to owners to just give them a heads up on what it is and what the hype was about to happen. I think the majority responded along the lines of is this something we have to worry about because we are not planning to do anything for a while. I think their user base really resents them. They especially do not want anything to do with subscriptions. Maybe they will upgrade for WIndows 11 or 12. Maybe Microsoft should listen to their customers for once instead of focusing on too many bells and whistles no one cares about. They don't want their stuff in your data center, they want to own their equipment, and they want to know where their data is and in their control. Oh - the hype about security - in today's world has become keeping their data backed up and mitigating the damage of a possible hack. They have lost confidence that Microsoft can keep anyone out of their systems.

          1. Tom 13

            Re: I think their user base really resents them.

            Bing! Bing! Bing!

            We have a winner!

            And until MS fix that problem, they're never going to have the sort of success they are seeking. Conceding to their customers by allowing vendors to sell Windows 7 might start that process. Holding out for Window 9 10 won't. Especially if between now and release date they try to pull the old Windows 8.x switcharoo.

        3. jelabarre59

          memory evolution

          But consider that there's plenty of perfectly servicable machibes taht can't run Win8, or can run it but not very well. Considering we're still mired in a long-term economic depression, no one has the cash to throw at new hardware. So no Win7 means those machines move to Linux, and suddenly users will start finding how superior Linux is to Windows.

          1. usbac Silver badge

            Re: memory evolution

            I've already converted three of our user's home systems to Linux Mint. They wanted to get off of XP, but expressly didn't want Windows 8.x

            They looked at buying new PCs/Laptops, but couldn't find them with Windows 7 anymore.

            I have one person bringing her home desktop in on Monday for me to load Mint on it (I already converted their laptop to Mint several months ago, as a test for them).

            So far every single one of them has been happy with the change.

            As IT people, we can promote the move away from Windows. We just need to show everyone we know that you can live with a non-Microsoft OS.

        4. Arthur Dent

          Re: A suggestion for MS

          I guess the current windows 8 lot are those who are desparate to escape from Windows 8 were too dumb to cope with some UI changes and then proved their dumbness by turning dow the free upgrade to Windows 8.1 when they were offered it (or never noticed the offer, perhaps because they junked all mail from MS).

          I tried Vista and switched back to XP. I tried windows 95 and switched back to Windows 3.1.1. I tried Windows NT 3.5 and switched back to Windows 3.1.1. I tried Windows 98 and switched back to Windows NT 4.0. I tried Windows ME and switched back to Windows 2000. I tried windows Vista and switched back to Windows XP. I tried Windows 8 and stuck with it until I got windows 8.1 as a free upgrade. To me, Windows 8 seemed nowhere near as bad as Windows 95, 98, NT 3.5, ME, or Vista - - the good verions of windows (for home use) were windows 2, windows 3.1.1, Windows 2000 Pro, windows XP Pro, maybe Windows 7 (I put it on some of teh families machines, never had a complaint, but stusk with my XP Pro on my machine until I bought a new one with Windows 8). I found the widespread anti-windows 8 reaction hard to understand, it wasn't enough different to make it hard to use (a much smaller change than the various Office changes - the new Office UI about years ago was a much bigger jump than that from XP to W 8, and Outlook 2013 is just bugridden junk, bring back Outlook from Office for XP!) and now that 8.1 is out I really don't understand what all the fuss is about.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: A suggestion for MS

        I had exactly the same problem!

        I installed Linux Mint while I was dithering about it. I'm no longer dithering, and realised the OS is irrelevant.

      3. Blitterbug
        Happy

        Re: A suggestion for MS

        Jeffy,

        I've been buying genuine W7 packages complete with CoA machine stickers online (Amazon, wyb!) which I think originates from a German seller. Not been a problem for me...

    5. big_D Silver badge

      Re: *

      Interesting that Vista market share rose. And according to Netmarketshare Windows 8.x has overtaken Xp...

  2. king of foo

    pwetty cuwors

    I like how vista and 8.x are nicely clustered together. Maybe a nice shade of brown for each would make the chart even prettier...

    Does this mean that w8 users are going -1 instead of +0.1? Or -w

  3. Khaptain Silver badge

    What about Gartner's results

    According to Gartner, Windows 10 will become the next best thing since the invention of fire. And because it is so wondefull , PC sales will fly throught the roof, everyone will buy 3 tablets, own 2 iWatches and have at least 4 connected 3D full wall TVs with every single electronic item in your house wired to the Internet of Things. All of this because market trending tells you so.....

    You think this sounds like bollocks, well have a read at Gartners view on W8 ( dated 2012)

    Windows 8

    The only valid thing they said about Windows 8 wat that is changes Windows as we know it. They couldn't have been closer to the truth.... except that it was for the worse

    Poeple actually pay this company for it "analysis" of markets.......

    1. Pete 2 Silver badge

      Re: What about Gartner's results

      > Poeple actually pay this company for it "analysis" of markets

      It's my understanding that people (well: high-level management) pay consultants for validation of their preconceived plans rather than to provide direction for their new ones.

      1. lotus49

        Re: What about Gartner's results

        Speaking as a consultant, what is wrong with that? We give them what they want and they give us what we want (i.e. money).

        It all seems to work pretty well from where I'm sitting.

      2. We're with Steve
        Pint

        Re: What about Gartner's results

        Well done sir. You reminded me of the quote "He uses statistics like a drunk man uses a lamp post. More for support than illumination".

        1. Arthur Dent

          Re: What about Gartner's results

          And there was me thinking it would be an aiming point. For people, of course, not just for the dogs.

          Not the statistics, I mean, but the lamppost.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Depends

      Have Gartner put Microsoft into upper left square of their Magic Quadrangle of Death?

      1. John Styles

        Re: Depends

        We at Weasel Consultants limited can go one better than putting you in the magic quadrant, we can put you in the centre of the unholy pentagram, the only place where your soul will not be eaten by Cthulhu. You know it makes sense. As much sense as Gartner, anyway.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What about Gartner's results

      "People actually pay this company for it "analysis" of markets......."

      No, companies pay several companies for analysis, and they cherrypick which one they like. This basically means, if you know your client is Microsoft, say Windows Phone/Surface Tablet/Xbox/Windows 8 is going to sell big guns, and you will get a large payment for your "report". It's in no way a bribe.

  4. P. Lee

    Do they really care?

    It's a bit like Unilever or P&G fretting over which of their brands of toothpaste is doing the best. W8 down, W8.1 up. Meh.

    1. thomas k.

      Re: Do they really care?

      Precisely! Unilever recently discontinued the scent (flavor?) of Caress bath soap which I'd been using for years and years (Velvet Bliss, if you must know). Tried the other 2 scents and was not thrilled by either so I've switched to Dove. It's also made by Unilever but it costs more than Caress so a win for Unilever, I guess.

      1. returnmyjedi

        Re: Do they really care?

        You flamboyant dandy. I use coal dust and a thistle to scrub myself clean.

        1. GregC

          Re: Do they really care?

          Thistle? A thistle? Back in my day we had to make do with some poison ivy (etc etc...)

          1. Vehlin

            Re: Do they really care?

            Poison Ivy? You were lucky!

            In my day the school toilets had that bog roll that was like greaseproof paper, at least poison ivy has some absorbent qualities.

            1. tony2heads

              new meme

              can we have a 4 yorkshiremen icon please

            2. auburnman

              Re: Do they really care?

              School toilets? You were lucky. Back in my day if you needed to go you were sent to fertilise the allotments round back.

              1. Chika

                Re: Do they really care?

                We were evicted from our allotment. We used to have to dig a hole int' middle o't road.

            3. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Do they really care?

              That bog roll was designed so it couldn't be stolen and used for something else (you couldn't write on it.)

              Unfortunately in the process it ceased to be usable as bog roll either.

              It is a perfect exemplar of the way the official mind works.

              1. monkeyfish

                Re: Do they really care?

                Not useable for bog roll also means a) no-one nicks it for their home use, and b) people actually start bring their own bog roll with them. It's win-win since you no longer have to re-stock.

                1. Anonymous Coward
                  Anonymous Coward

                  Re: Do they really care?

                  Yes, that is the way the official mind works. Making something so bad people decide to provide their own instead is the core operating principle of modern government.

                  1. Anonymous Coward
                    Anonymous Coward

                    Re: Do they really care?

                    And the principle behind BYOD.

              2. Doctor_Wibble
                Headmaster

                Re: Do they really care?

                The only hard bog paper I ever saw was shiny one side and rough on the other - ink tended not to work well but pencil was absolutely fine, thus ensuring its use as actual tracing paper for many generations.

                e.g. one of my dad's old text books (organic chemistry, appropriately enough) still has a square of the stuff with a beautifully-traced crystal structure on it.

                For an even further-away tangent, the book was from the olden days when you had instructions like 'carefully drip' liquid x into mixture y because one had something-benz-something and the other had something-nitric-something and tipping it in by the bucketful would be under the heading of 'somewhat unwise'...

                Mr Teech ikon cos its all edukayshunul innit

                1. Brian Souder 1

                  Re: Do they really care?

                  "The only hard bog paper I ever saw was shiny one side and rough on the other - ink tended not to work well but pencil was absolutely fine, thus ensuring its use as actual tracing paper for many generations."

                  You guys had toilet paper? Must have been those rich uppity types. ;-)

              3. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Do they really care?

                The old grease-proof paper bog roll (brand Bronco?) was brilliant. Most of our geography lessons relied upon it for tracing paper to copy maps etc.. As for its intended use: at least it did not let moisture seep through or tear.

                Ah, skid marks, those were the days.

                1. Anonymous Coward
                  Anonymous Coward

                  Re: Do they really care?

                  Our school's smear-paper was "Izal".

                  From the same Ministry of Crap Design that brings us non-absorbent decorative tea-towels that rearrange the moisture on a wet plate into a slightly thinner more even layer instead of actually drying it away.

                  1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge
                    Happy

                    Re: Do they really care?

                    Our school's smear-paper was "Izal".

                    I believe they have since change their name to ISIS. Oor is it ISIL? Their policy of inhuman brutality has remained the same...

                    1. Tom 7

                      Re: Do they really care? Izal

                      from the latin for 'spread it around until it dries out and drops off'.

                      That was one shit toilet paper.

                  2. Anonymous Coward
                    Anonymous Coward

                    Re: Do they really care?

                    Izal "medicated" (in what way, I have no idea.)

                    Ah yes, we called it "John Wayne bog paper".

                    Rough, tough, and don't take no shit from anyone.

                    1. Intractable Potsherd

                      Re: Do they really care?

                      My parents actually used to buy Izal for use in our home! I used to think it was normal, and that the tissue stuff that wadded up your bum crack or split so that you wiped your arse on your middle finger was the cheap stuff! I also liked the disinfectant smell of Izal...

            4. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Do they really care?

              Ahh, you mean "Badgers Arse" brand, with added wood pulp and flint chippings...

        2. Cipher

          Re: Do they really care?

          I saw what you did there... :-)

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