back to article BBC to demand logins for iPlayer in early 2017

The BBC is going to require users to log in to access content on iPlayer from early 2017. As part of the BBC iD programme the corporation intends to use watchers' personal accounts to collect data on its audience's interests to tailor its programming. The BBC stated: “TV Licensing will have access to the information but … it …

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  1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

    "The login scheme may be used for enforcement purposes in the future, however, and the BBC's own media correspondent considered that “the inclusion of a postcode as part of the new compulsory sign-up information"

    W1A 1AA

    No problem.

    On a more serious note I hope this doesn't bugger up get_iplayer.

    1. batfastad

      My first thoughts as well about get_iplayer. I have a feeling it's doomed.

      1. Warm Braw

        I have a feeling it's doomed

        The timing is remarkably coincidental with the attempted crackdown on Kodi.

        1. aelfric

          NOT a crackdown on Kodi

          This is a crackdown on pirate TV streaming boxes built using Kodi and illegally using the Kodi trademark. Kodi specifically disavows any association with these boxes and would be glad to see them all disappear.

      2. yossarianuk

        get_iplayer - radio ?

        Will the changes be needed (i.e login, etc) for listening to radio shows (Live and previously recorded) ?

        As I don't give a toss about TV shows, I do like to download various 6 Music (Craig charles, Gilles peterson, Cerys) and documentaries on world service and radio 4.

    2. Vulch

      Nah, W12 8QT. Let them hunt round the flats they've built there...

      1. Steve Evans

        I'm glad I'm not the only one with W12 8QT burnt into their subconscious.

        I don't know who to blame, swap shop or Blue Peter.

        1. Steve K

          Blue Peter

          Blue Peter in my case!!

          1. Neil Barnes Silver badge
            Happy

            Re: Blue Peter

            Both W1A 1AA and W12 8QT - I worked at both of them...

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Trollface

              Re: Blue Peter

              Try FIQQ 1ZZ - postcode for the Falkland Islands.

              That will blow their brains!

            2. David Nash Silver badge

              Re: Blue Peter

              Was W1A 4WW Radio 1 in the 70s or 80s? I haven't listened since then though!

        2. Putters

          Phone No. Too

          01 811 8055 burnt into the next field in the brain.

          Along with (if you're a fan old old British films) WHItehall 1212 (Scotland Yard)

          And for trivia fans, the TfL helpline (in the building over the road) was WHItehall 1234 and is (0343 222 )1234 to this day ...

          1. Gerry 3

            Re: Phone No. Too

            No, it was ABBey 1234, then 01-222 1234 etc.

          2. thunderghast

            Re: Phone No. Too

            "If you're calling from outside London..." Those were the days!

          3. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

            Re: Phone No. Too

            "Along with (if you're a fan old old British films) WHItehall 1212 (Scotland Yard)"

            Old films? I can remember it being real e.g. "Listeners who see a man in the Whitechapel area wearing blood-stained clothing are asked to ring Whitehall 1212 immediately."

            1. Anonymous C0ward

              Re: Phone No. Too

              081 811 8181

              (letters)

    3. DavCrav

      My login for ITV Player was absolutely definitely not David Cameron of 10 Downing St, London, SW1A 2AA, DoB 9/10/1966. I guess I should update those details now...

  2. djstardust

    Crapita

    Have the contract for enforcement.

    I wouldn't worry too much, they are a f***n disaster on a good day.

    As above, just enter any old tripe as a postcode as they have absolutely no way of telling where you are.

  3. JimmyPage Silver badge
    Big Brother

    Presumably, logins will be address based

    not personal ? Thereby following the logic of the TV licence.

    Or will we have to trust the BBC with the details - and viewing habits - of every person in a household.

    Even the minors ?

    1. Horridbloke

      Re: Presumably, logins will be address based

      Nope, just those people who watch BBC / iPlayer.

  4. barstewardsquad

    How long

    How long before they need more than just a postcode? After all it is hardly a deterrent to find one to enter, say DL98 1TL for example. I was unable to check if they would accept that one though as apparently they are doing maintenance to their systems that are used for signing it and registering.

    I can see the headline already, BBC iD site down to unexpected demand for accounts.

  5. TRT Silver badge

    But surely...

    just a serial number or passcode off your TV license should do the trick. I mean, it's not like location services aren't available from most device APIs anyway.

    1. phuzz Silver badge

      Re: But surely...

      The wrinkle is that your TV license is tied to an address, but that address might contain several people who all want to watch BBC/iPlayer, so they either allow multiple logins from a single account, or multiple logins can share one license.

      Location based monitoring isn't much use either, because your TV license allows you to watch/listen to BBC stuff while you're outside your house.

      Any licensing scheme would have to cope with the totally legit scenario of (for example) one person in the living room, watching TV on an actual TV, via radiowaves (neanderthal), another watching live tv via a desktop computer, a third watching iPlayer on a tablet, and someone else watching via a phone whilst several miles away across town.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: But surely...

        "Any licensing scheme would have to cope with the totally legit scenario of (for example) one person in the living room, watching TV on an actual TV, via radiowaves (neanderthal), another watching live tv via a desktop computer, a third watching iPlayer on a tablet, and someone else watching via a phone whilst several miles away across town."

        This has already been solved by the numerous subscription services that are available. It would only require a slight tweak to adjust it for the iPlayer - licenced household model.

        1. TRT Silver badge

          Re: But surely...

          Erm... would you really use a hotel's MyID login? I'm not saying that there shouldn't be a MyID login; I was questioning the validity and usefulness of collecting postcode information when the legal requirement is now to have a TV license for the property you live in (assuming it's not commercial property of course) and there's way more than 1 TV license / household per postcode anyway, and that on a mobile device you might not be in the postcode that your MyID is associated with.

          1. Wensleydale Cheese

            Re: But surely...

            "Erm... would you really use a hotel's MyID login?"

            The answer is possibly "Yes" if I'm staying a hotel for several months at a time while working away from home.

            I honestly don't know and that's why I'm curious.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: But surely...

      Yes, I don't understand why they are so keen to say "it's okay we're only collecting all your personal data and personal viewing habits but don't worry we won't be use it to make people pay for a TV licence".

      It is now law that you have to have a TV licence for watching content on BBC iPlayer, so why not ensure you have a login that required a TV licence to use, the same as every other paid for streaming service.

      There is no point in using the amendments to create a law that requires a TV licence and then going out of the way to say "don't panic we aren't going to enforce it".

      1. TRT Silver badge

        Re: But surely...

        My point was that asking you to put in a postcode to provide regional services is pretty useless given, as you say, mobile devices nowadays means it could be in use anywhere. I can understand the MyID idea - to tie what a person watches with their login so your iPlayer recommends doesn't fill up with period drama, GBBO and soaps when you're into Robot Wars, University Challenge and Click! But how do you tie MyID into a valid TV license which is what they've persuaded the law-givers is needed to reflect modern viewing habits and ensure continuation of a funded service? It just doesn't make sense. It's some kind of Chewbacca defence.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: But surely...

          > My point was that asking you to put in a postcode to provide regional services is pretty useless given, as you say, mobile devices nowadays means it could be in use anywhere.

          The law has covered this for years. You can legally use a 'battery powered' device at any location so long as your home is licensed. It creates a peculiar situation where a student watching on a laptop in their digs is covered by their parent's licence unless they plug the laptop into the mains.

          I am curious as to how this login thing will effect radio and S4C content as neither require a TV licence to consume.

          1. TRT Silver badge

            Re: But surely...

            This is true. But there's nothing stopping them allowing, say 16 associations of a MyID per TV license serial number. Should be enough to cover most legitimate households. Or they could just investigate the cases where, say, 200 unique MyIDs are quoting a single license number. They have the license holder's details on file.

            1. Wensleydale Cheese

              Hotels?

              " Or they could just investigate the cases where, say, 200 unique MyIDs are quoting a single license number. They have the license holder's details on file."

              So what happens if you are accessing it from a hotel?

              I assume that any hotel with TVs in bedrooms will have appropriate licences.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Hotels?

                "So what happens if you are accessing it from a hotel?"

                You will still need your own licence to watch on your own device at a hotel. The hotel licence will only cover their own TVs, installed in their locations.

                You wouldn't be expected to log in to BBC iPlayer using the Hotel's licence details.

                1. tiggity Silver badge

                  Re: Hotels?

                  But your licence does not allow you to use your device *plugged in* elsewhere (hence students using parents TV licence to save cash & only using iplayer when device not plugged into mains) - and in hotel you might want to charge it and watch iplayer...

                  So a bit of a grey area if hotel TV licence does not cover your iplayer use (plugged in)

          2. Anonymous Coward
            WTF?

            Re: But surely...

            The law has covered this for years. You can legally use a 'battery powered' device at any location so long as your home is licensed. It creates a peculiar situation where a student watching on a laptop in their digs is covered by their parent's licence unless they plug the laptop into the mains.

            It is even more bizare than that. e.g. someone is using iPlayer on their phone on the train or wherever. After a bit, the battery starts going flat, so they plug it into the mains and are now breaking the law. I guess iPlayer could conceivably one day include some sort of battery state monitoring for the automatic generation of court summons?

            1. tiggity Silver badge

              Re: But surely...

              Battery state monitoring no use - I have external charger my phone often runs off on long journeys - so not plugged into mains but still getting charged

          3. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

            Re: But surely...

            "I am curious as to how this login thing will effect radio and S4C content as neither require a TV licence to consume."

            I'm curious as to when LG will update the iPlayer app on my 2 year old TV so I can enter my shiny new BBC iD code. There was one update IIRC when I first connected it to the network, but as we all know, LG and their pals in the industry are not well known for producing updates for more than a year before deciding your £300+ TV needs replacing if you want s/w updates to be current.

  6. Andy The Hat Silver badge

    ID?

    Why not just ask for the tv licence number and post code of the property and done with?

    On the other hand, given that most users are on DDNS, can smart tvs store trackable info (like an iPlayer cookie) for streaming services? If not, every time you try to watch The Great British Bog Off the thing is going to ask for id info ... "ERROR : no cake without a cookie" ...

    All this prattling about is doing my head in.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: ID?

      Smart TVs seems to store your login details for Netflix and other media accounts so I can't see that it would be a problem for a BBC login.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: ID?

        Smart (sic) TV's connected to the internet? Wow you are living dangeously.

        Are you sure that the Microphone and camera on your so called 'smart' TV is covered up? We don't want the Internet spying on you do we? (te-he)

        Smart TV's are IoT crap as far as I'm concerned. Yes, they can let you watch Netflix. Whoope do. for everything else a devent PVR is far better and does not spy on you.

        1. Andy The Hat Silver badge

          Re: ID?

          "a devent PVR is far better and does not spy on you."

          Still have 3 Humax boxes in the house ... much prefer them to streaming the Great British Break-Up on a slow connection.

          "Did you know this is available in HD?"

          "Yes, do you know how much bandwidth the user needs to watch you bleedin' service in HD without it looking like a damn chessboard after a evening out with the BOFH?"

      2. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

        Re: ID?

        "Smart TVs seems to store your login details for Netflix and other media accounts so I can't see that it would be a problem for a BBC login."

        Unless the iPlayer app on the TV already has a login function built in, then don't hold your breath waiting for an OTA update from the manufacturer.

  7. inmypjs Silver badge

    "Why can’t I sign into my BBC account today?"

    "We're running some scheduled maintenance on our systems today, which means you can't sign in or register for a BBC account right now. We're sorry for the inconvenience, but things will be back to normal by tea time tonight."

    Just lol. I occasionally watch iplayer, but, anything worth watching on the beeb is available elsewhere on the internet in better quality and DRM free.

    Having to log in will annoy the crap out of me (I don't do permanent cookies for anyone). If getting an 'iD' requires violation of my personal privacy policy (of not providing any valid information to anyone on the internet if I don't have to) then I won't bother.

    Hardly watch any live TV so maybe it will be time to get rid of the license.

    1. inmypjs Silver badge

      Re: "Why can’t I sign into my BBC account today?"

      After tea time....

      Throw away email address and postcode for broadcasting house worked fine.

      Maybe I should create a few more spare iDs just in case - oh and it is called a BBC account now not iD.

  8. Blofeld's Cat
    Coat

    Right ...

    "... it will not be used for enforcement purposes ..."

    "The thought hadn't even begun to speculate about the merest possibility of crossing my mind" - Douglas Adams, HHGTTG

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Meh

      Re: Right ...

      "... it will not be used for enforcement purposes ..."

      Not having a TV iplayer licence is a criminal offence, so the forces of law and order can legally obtain access to the data regardless of the purposes stated for its collection and retention.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Right ...

        >Not having a TV iplayer licence is a criminal offence, so the forces of law and order can legally obtain access to the data regardless of the purposes stated for its collection and retention.

        Not for much longer as it's moving to a civil offence - it's pretty much impossible to be convicted now unless you self-incriminate. Even if they were able trace your IP they have to prove who was actually watching - not the property/phone etc they were watching from.

    2. Whitter
      Unhappy

      Re: Right ...

      What purposes *will* it be used for?

      1. Hollerithevo

        Re: Right ...

        Marketing.

        I would rather it be used for enforcement than to spam me on 'since you watched this, you might like that' or, in my case, 'why you no watch television??'

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Meh

          Re: Right ...

          in my case, 'why you no watch television??'

          Alternatively, your inbox will be completely stuffed with spam advertising television sets, and your "online experience" will mostly involve seeing lots of adverts for television sets.

  9. Nik 2

    Smart TV's too?

    I can't see my semi-smart TV being able to cope with this. Software evolution driving hardware obsolescence :-(

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