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back to article Microsoft 'touches 16k shop workers' to flog Windows 8 hard

Microsoft says Windows 8 PC sales were cursed by the unholy trinity of a slow economy, incursions by Apple and Android tablets, and the "ambitious" user interface design. But the software giant insisted it is working with retailers and manufacturers to supply hardware that people actually want in time for the peak sales season …

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          1. breakfast Silver badge
            Reply Icon
            Facepalm

            Re: "Ambitious" as synonym for "Awful"?

            You're having to explain to someone who works full time as a Windows developer and has done for a long time now, how to do basic Windows tasks through the Reg forums. This hasn't happened with any previous version of Windows. I should be able to look at the screen, try a few things and figure out what I need to do- I shouldn't need to Bing it on my Zune to find how to do the basics.

            The thing is, after 20 years or so of refinement, Windows usability *wasn't wrong* - most people could figure out how to do most things. There was no reason to change it for most users. See also Visual Studio 2012 - it's like they took the usability guidelines and threw them out the window for that.

            The whole thing reeks of Microsoft trying to be cool. Obviously, I'm a programmer, I don't know much about being cool, but I do know that one thing that nobody ever got cool by trying.

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            1. El Andy
              Reply Icon

              Re: "Ambitious" as synonym for "Awful"?

              @breakfast: The world has moved on. Sure you could just leave things as they were, but they'll become increasingly less relevant or useful to most people. The idea that the classic "desktop + Start menu" is somehow UI perfection is as ridiculous as similar comments back in the days when DOS was being phased out, or Win 3 after that.

              Regardless of whether it's "cool" or not, or whether it requires people (yes, even programmers!) to learn new stuff, it's still important to move things forward. The absolute one way to be guaranteed to become obsolete is to do nothing at all.

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              1. breakfast Silver badge
                Reply Icon
                Facepalm

                Re: "Ambitious" as synonym for "Awful"?

                I'm not saying things should be left as they were. I am saying that things should not *deliberately be made worse*. That is a massive difference.

                I love usability changes that make things more usable. I'm all in favour of those.

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        2. M Gale
          Reply Icon

          Re: "Ambitious" as synonym for "Awful"?

          Also what happens when you minimise an application in TIFKAM?

          Nothing. The application carries on flicking between running and suspended states in the background until such time as the OS decides it needs more memory. The program then gets a short time (5 seconds if I remember that lecture correctly) to save anything important before it is forcibly terminated.

          See also here.

          So in the future when everything's Modern, will I watch everything slow to a crawl if I enable power saving, because there's no close button on the million and one store apps open? Or will I end up with the system deciding what apps I get to have immediately available and what ones get extra added switch times and the uncertainty of whether they really did manage to save everything in the time required?

          Someone really should apply a chair-end to Ballmer's cranium and tell him a PC isn't a games console or a phone.

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      2. Asok Asus
        Reply Icon
        Holmes

        The Identical Desktop

        "The desktop mode, which is essentially identical to Win 7?"

        LOL@ThePaidMicroTroll!

        You mean the "essentially identical desktop mode" that has no Start Menu, is impossible to boot into directly without third party software, keeps jumping back to the horrid Metro UI at the drop of a hat, and crazy things keep zooming onto the screen from random directions if you accidentally move the mouse the wrong way? Do you mean that "identical desktop"?

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        1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge
          Reply Icon
          Stop

          Re: The Identical Desktop

          Asok Asus,

          Someone disagrees with you. It doesn't make them either a shill or a troll. It just means they hold a different opinion. It's really not a hard concept to grasp. Please stop it!

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  2. captain veg Silver badge

    Advice to Microsoft

    PANIC NOW!

    -A.

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  3. RISC OS
    FAIL

    Re: "consumers didn't understand touch-based laptops"

    Consumers understand touchscreen... what they don't understand is why they are so expensive, or why they should pay hundreds more and have worse specs... apple only got away with that by exploiting idots that think price = quality, and they could only do that by not having cheap good quality hardware in the first place, sadly MS has been helping to flog cheap hardware for decadeds by giving away windows and offering OEMs discounts to bundle windows with their hardware.

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  4. Miek
    Linux

    "But the software giant insisted it is working with retailers and manufacturers to supply hardware that people actually want in time for the peak sales season this spring." -- It's the lack of a decent operating system that's the problem not a lack of decent hardware. I was dissuaded from by a very nice, very shiny Samsung Ultra Book simply because it came with W8 and there were no W7 drivers available on the Sammy website.

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    1. Chris Long
      Reply Icon
      Trollface

      @Miek

      Possibly the first recorded case of a fool and his money not being parted.

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  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    For "ambitious," read, "Crap."

    And, for "different comfort levels," read, "people don't like it."

    How many millions can I expect from Microsoft for this ultimate piece of management consultancy: Stop living and dealing in lies. There, I've just transformed your company's future. I think I deserve a few pennies.

    Of course, Mr Ballmer and colleagues might find that they have different comfort levels with my advice.

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  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Windows 8 reminds me of an old joke about meeting customer requirements.

    A man goes into shop and asks for a particular widget. The shopkeep says to him in an exasperated voice "look - you're the hundredth person I've told today - there's no call for that widget".

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    1. Vic
      Reply Icon

      > Windows 8 reminds me of an old joke about meeting customer requirements.

      Reminds me of a joke about management...

      "It is a crock of shit and it stinketh."

      Vic.

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  7. stevesx
    Linux

    Windows 8 could be great for 3D design applications.

    A large screen, high power, Windows 8 kit could be very useful in applications such as 3D Studio or Blender for example. With a few improvements to the software workflow, they could become so much easier and more intuitive to use with a touchscreen. Definitely, they would be a great way to demonstrate the potential of touch-screen computing.

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  8. Bynar
    Facepalm

    And todays Microsoft rep on a comments thread is...

    Chris Long.

    Not including a classic desktop sort of mode in Windows 8 is the biggest act of stupidity I have seen in a long time. I installed Win 8 on my spare laptop at home just to see what the crack was, I'll be buggered if I put that on my main rig as my day to day OS. Productivity seems to have been an after thought...lets make it all pretty instead.

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    1. Chris Long
      Reply Icon
      Thumb Up

      Re: And todays Microsoft rep on a comments thread is...

      @Bynar

      Errr... it does have a classic desktop mode... did you forget to press the Windows key? Are you one of these people who can't cope without the Start menu?

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      1. Asok Asus
        Reply Icon
        Holmes

        Re: And todays Microsoft rep on a comments thread is...

        Windows KEY? KEY? As in remove my hand from my mouse and type when I don't actually need to input some text? Like with Dos 3.1? As in USE THE KEYBOARD to compensate for a "touch" UI that is so broken that using the KEYBOARD is more efficient than using the mouse?

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        1. Chris Long
          Reply Icon

          Re: And todays Microsoft rep on a comments thread is...

          @Asok Asus

          No, if you already have your hand on the mouse, go to the bottom left corner and left-click - you know, like you do know to get to the Start menu (What? That glowing orb thing is a menu? How is anyone supposed to know that?).

          You guys should really try using Win 8, it'll be quicker than me trying to train you all up myself.

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          1. M Gale
            Reply Icon

            Re: And todays Microsoft rep on a comments thread is...

            You guys should really try using Win 8, it'll be quicker than me trying to train you all up myself.

            I have a free copy thanks to Dreamspark, but there's little to no chance of it escaping its virtual machine. Tried it, didn't like it. If I want a games console, I'll buy a games console.

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      2. Anonymous Coward
        Reply Icon
        Linux

        Re: can't cope without the Start menu?

        I choose not to.

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  9. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Hubris

    'Microsoft says Windows 8 PC sales were cursed by the unholy trinity of a slow economy, incursions by Apple and Android tablets, and the "ambitious" user interface design.'

    What actually happened was that Windows 8 PC sales were cursed by the unholy trinity of the fact that nobody bought it, the fact that nobody bought it and the fact that nobody bought it.

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  10. Stuart Ball

    My Youngest was most put out that a cross platform painting programme she used on my Asus Transformer was not "Touch-Enabled" when using it on Windows, as her monitor doesn't have touchscreen.She point blank refused to use the mouse to finger-paint.

    There is a danger we are missing the point in that Touch is not an interface for "our" generation, but those actually growing up with touch now. MS is laying the groundwork, possibly badly, for future markets.

    However £400 for a touchscreen standalone monitor is a TAD excessive.

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    1. Asok Asus
      Reply Icon
      Holmes

      Windows 8: The perfect OS for finger painting.

      "She point blank refused to use the mouse to finger-paint."

      Because I believe you are sincere and not a paid MicroTroll, I'll be gentle. I think it's a sad commentary on the utility of Metro UI that finger painting by a child is being touted as being a highlight of an OS . On the other hand, in point of fact, I do think finger painting does in fact completely exemplify the utility of touch and Metro UI.

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      1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge
        Reply Icon
        Stop

        Re: Windows 8: The perfect OS for finger painting.

        Please stop being an arse and calling people shills.

        Thank you.

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      2. Anonymous Coward
        Reply Icon
        Trollface

        Re: Windows 8: The perfect OS for finger painting.

        Yep. Let's hear how that child gets on doing her word processing and spreadsheets. She'll be finding out what keyboards and mice are for!

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    2. Roland6 Silver badge
      Reply Icon

      My Youngest was most put out

      My youngest was most put out by the TV remote as it didn't talk to her and so would throw it across the room. A year or so later she worked out the difference between the TV remote and a phone and is now a competent user of both for the tasks they were designed for and no longer tries to talk to the TV remote...

      Interestingly, neither of my children try and use the desktop's touch screen even though they happily use the iPad...

      So no I disagree touch isn't an interface for a new generation, it is just a more convenient version of the stylus interface that has existed since at least the 1970's and has more applications written to make use of it.

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  11. Levente Szileszky
    Devil

    "Ambitious", bwahahaha...

    ...what a classic, hilarious Ballmerian BS. :)

    Seriously: just how long his clowns are willing to embarrass themselves publicly with all these preposterous nonsensical BS "explanations" for tanking sales instead of admitting that their product is a half-baked, homework-quality, unfinished, utterly idiotic, two-headed monstrous PoS that would need another year to finish it (ie get rid of this abomination called Metro UI)?

    In other words: how long Ballmer's striking incompetence and his team of bunglers (= senior mgmt) will be tolerated by the shareholders/board? BALLMER and HIS ILKS MUST GO, and ASAP.

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  12. Asok Asus
    Holmes

    Sounds like an excuse symphony to me.

    Sounds like Microsoft is getting tuned up for the excuse symphony they're gonna be needing regarding the impending failure of the Windows 8/Windows RT/Surface ecosystem.

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  13. JeffyPooh
    Pint

    "...and the 'ambitious' user interface design."

    You spelled 'rubbish' incorrectly.

    It's not just that I don't want Win 8 in my life, it's that I'm going to actively avoid it. Maybe Win 10 will return to normal programming.

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    1. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Devil

      Re: Face it Metro is going to rule the world!

      What I enjoyed most about that was the co-ordinated chair chucking that goes with each line

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  15. David Strum
    Linux

    An IBM moment – me thinks.

    This is a turning point in this corporate giant's fortunes; it’s become sloppy and slovenly – just like its CEO. It’s like a gambling man – in the process of losing all that fortune he has amassed. Our lively hoods as Technicians are tied to its apron strings - but it’s time to call Microsoft a failing company.

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  16. s. pam Silver badge
    Thumb Down

    YUCK -- I had to use Windows 8 and I didn't like it!

    We visited our son last weekend and I had to help him with his new computer win 8.

    Never has an OS made me swear more, more loudly, made me more want to vomit than this ebola virus on a machine. I also had violent spells of diarrhoea afterwards and will be seeking compensation for counselling.

    What a /dev/fucked OS it is..

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